From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, REPLYTO_WITHOUT_TO_CC autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,309015504ed37ff0 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-09-29 13:28:22 PST Path: news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!newsmi-us.news.garr.it!NewsITBone-GARR!news.mailgate.org!newsfeed.icl.net!newsfeed.fjserv.net!skynet.be!skynet.be!newshub1.home.nl!home.nl!newsfeed.multikabel.nl!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!195.129.110.21.MISMATCH!bnewsfeed00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewsinpeer00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!bnewspost00.bru.ops.eu.uu.net!emea.uu.net!businessnews.de.uu.net!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Usage of Interfaces with Ada 95 Reply-To: bauhaus@futureapps.de References: <1064595326.831730@master.nyc.kbcfp.com> <4nii41-067.ln1@boavista.snafu.de> From: Georg Bauhaus Date: 29 Sep 2003 21:37:03 +0200 Message-ID: <86y8w7idy8.fsf@strudel.futureapps.de> User-Agent: Gnus/5.09 (Gnus v5.9.0) Emacs/21.2 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii NNTP-Posting-Host: 193.102.189.176 X-Trace: 1064867301 businessnews.de.uu.net 273 193.102.189.176 X-Complaints-To: abuse@de.uu.net Xref: news1.google.com comp.lang.ada:212 Date: 2003-09-29T21:37:03+02:00 List-Id: >>>>> "Matthew" == Matthew Heaney writes: : Simon Wright writes: :: Personally I have no problem at all with what the :: STL does, just some of the names it's adopted for the concepts .. : The English-speaking world (and the German-speaking world too, : apparently) has settled on the terms "container" and "iterator." As for German, that settling (which is a fashion rather, I'd say) is certainly not an argument, if you care about language. (And I'm glad to have seen a Deprecated names package in Charles, so some language work is being done ;-) People seem to have differing views of what "iterator" should mean, but that aside, might we suspect that there is some Russian English in Stepanov's work? For example, every other "new computer word" here (in Germany) has been coined out of helpless (and probalby thoughtless) ignorance (no rebuke intended), being pressed for a word. There is "gedownloadet" which is there because people haven't bothered to think about what "download" means, or even just look it up in an older computer dictionary. If you know that "geladen" is a perfect match for "loaded", why not use "geladen", as has been done until a few years ago? Personally, I'm impressed with learned language use which is both idiomatic and traditional, though not outdated, and that is not just common in current computer speak, or, hip if I may say so. The former I find is the case in Burns' and Wellings' "Concurrency in Ada". Sometimes their way of employing natural language is as different from that found in other computer textbooks as it is helpful in understanding. It might be fun if you mix two languages and grammars like Martin Luther and friends did with Latin and German. However, Luther's translation of the reference book of Christian religion is an attempt to avoid Pigeon German. Still another language's influence might add to expressive power of a language. Which version of "Iterator" is better in that respect? : And "factory method." And "visitor." And whatever. So stop : fighting it and read Gamma! who is German. ("Refactoring" is becoming popular as well. Search the Google c.l.ada archives for "refactoring", and "pompous" :-) You will certainly have noticed that English is not a language I know well enough to be allowed these paragraphs. Still, sometimes reading STL speak (or, though to a lesser extent, Booch speak) is as if by analogy I have to groke the new fictitious linear algebra term "samegestaltism" which is then just barely related to "homomorphism". Maybe it is a good thing to have "slightly new words" for the new STL way? Georg