From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,INVALID_MSGID autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 10d15b,d730ea9d54f7e063 X-Google-Attributes: gid10d15b,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,dab7d920e4340f12 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 1014db,dab7d920e4340f12 X-Google-Attributes: gid1014db,public From: Craig Franck Subject: Re: C is 'better' than Ada because... Date: 1996/08/14 Message-ID: <4ur9ii$7r4@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net>#1/1 X-Deja-AN: 174031911 references: <31EA0B65.3EF8@wgs.estec.esa.nl> <31EF7E48.5ABE@lmtas.lmco.com> <4ss8ru$3d4@felix.seas.gwu.edu> <31F28DBD.2A1D@harris.com> <31f3c52e.238719470 <4tnoeh$qjr@maverick.tad.eds.com> <4uj42h$j06@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> <4um1l9$klq@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii organization: AT&T WorldNet Services mime-version: 1.0 newsgroups: comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.c,comp.lang.cobol x-mailer: Mozilla 1.22ATT (Windows; U; 16bit) Date: 1996-08-14T00:00:00+00:00 List-Id: jsa@alexandria (Jon S Anthony) wrote: >In article <4uopmu$hod@mtinsc01-mgt.ops.worldnet.att.net> Craig Franck writes: > >> My statement was a hyperbole; an extravagant exaggeration. I can >> not defend it in a literal sense. The fact the US government, >> particularly as it relates to the Military Industrial Complex >> had anything to do with the creation of Ada, makes me highly >> suspicous. But to say something is bad just because of where >> it came from would be to commit the genetic fallacy of reasoning, >> so I won't comment on that any futher. > >Hmmm, how do you feel about using news? email? the internet in general? >All are US DARPA funded projects. > >Don't fly at all I suppose either? Most commercial aircraft are >directly traceable to their military roots. Or use the interstate >road system? Or... > >Now, I'd be the first to say that most things associated with the >government are pretty bad (useless, worthless, fill_in_the_blank). >But, as you seem to agree, to reason to the universal here is a bad >piece of logic. I'm glad you agree! I was recently told that VCR technology came from the need to embed detailed information about an area, so a cruise missile could fly low to the ground and hit an exact target. I love watching movies so, if thats where it came from, I don't care! Perhaps I could give you some of what I have been told, some theories of how programming languages spread. In the past the government has made proclamations to the effect that if a compiler for a certain language is not available on a piece of computing machinery, we ain't gunna buy it. They have said in the past (and if I'm wrong correct me, because my batting average is a little low) that they wouldn't buy a computer for data processing that didn't have a COBOL compiler. The number crunchers they were more forgiving on but having a FORTRAN compiler up and going on a platform, shure did help. That helped these languages spread. I have been told that what killed ALGOL was not ALGOL-68, but the fact that IBM gave you a FORTRAN compiler(o.k if they didn't give it to you with the computer, they still had one) and getting an ALGOL compiler was more work. Now Ada comes along. Want to bid on a contract to do embeded systems programming? Do it in Ada, because that's what the specifications are for the project. Got a neat little micro-controller we can put in something? Got an Ada compiler for it? The point is that when the government throws it's weight behind something, it has an impact. Now there are lots of reasons to do most of your programming in one language. Saves *alot* of money, no doubt. But if someone say's we have looked at this problem and we think Smalltalk is the best HLL to go with and they say "didn't you read the specifications of the project?, We are going with Ada!" that squews thing's in Ada's behalf. Now, perhaps I'm wrong again and you can just pick and choose 'tell your harts content on what language you can use on a particular project, but if that's not the case, then perhaps a case could be made that even if Ada was designed by the best minds on the planet, *alot* of it's success came from it being the darling of the DOD. It's first spefication, I believe, was DOD-1. This in itself doesn't bother me(like I said, I still rent video's) but quite often cloat sets standards, not technical excellence. Craig ----- clfranck@worldnet.att.net Manchester, NH There are no electrons...