From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.1 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_05,INVALID_MSGID autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 101deb,f96f757d5586710a X-Google-Attributes: gid101deb,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,5ac12f5a60b1bfe X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: f43e6,5ac12f5a60b1bfe X-Google-Attributes: gidf43e6,public From: frank@bigdog.engr.arizona.edu (Frank Manning) Subject: Re: Ariane 5 - not an exception? Date: 1996/08/06 Message-ID: <4u69g9$157k@news.ccit.arizona.edu>#1/1 X-Deja-AN: 172394158 references: <31FE35BC.1A0D@sanders.lockheed.com> <4totv7$o9f@goanna.cs.rmit.edu.au> <32065615.77C7@sanders.lockheed.com> organization: College of Engineering and Mines, University of Arizona newsgroups: comp.software-eng,comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.pl1 Date: 1996-08-06T00:00:00+00:00 List-Id: In article <32065615.77C7@sanders.lockheed.com> Steve O'Neill writes: > [...] > Just because I am programming in PL/I doesn't mean I am magically a > better real-time developer. > [...] I agree totally. > Certainly you and I would not have shut down the system but what about > the vast majority of developers without as much experience or who thought > that their job was to implement the requirements that they were given? > [...] Over the years I periodically see Usenet debates about what the term "software engineering" really means. It seems to me the Ariane problem brings the question into sharp relief. In a sci.aeronautics discussion about the Ariane problem, someone brought up the interesting point there are two trends on a collision course -- the increasing automation of flight vehicles, and the plummeting number of new vehicle designs (see article in sci.aero). In other words, there are few engineers with more than one new vehicle design under their belts, much less with vehicles having such unprecedented automation requirements. So how do you prevent another Ariane 5 problem? You really need people who understand both aerospace engineering (another somewhat nebulous term) and software engineering. Merely using ++robin's PL/I magic bullet won't do it. Like Steve says, you can't fault developers who implement the requirements they're given, especially if the developers have no specialized training in aerospace engineering. The converse is also true -- what do you do about aero engineers (or mechanical/electrical/ etc.) who have little training in -- forgive me -- software engineering? How do you bridge the gulf? -- Frank Manning -- Chair, AIAA-Tucson Section