From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, REPLYTO_WITHOUT_TO_CC autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Thread: 5b1e799cdb,3ef3e78eacf6f938 X-Google-Attributes: gid5b1e799cdb,public,usenet X-Google-NewGroupId: yes X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII Path: g2news2.google.com!news4.google.com!feeder.news-service.com!xlned.com!feeder3.xlned.com!news2.euro.net!news-out1.kabelfoon.nl!newsfeed.kabelfoon.nl!xindi.nntp.kabelfoon.nl!npeer.de.kpn-eurorings.net!npeer-ng0.de.kpn-eurorings.net!newsfeed.arcor.de!newsspool4.arcor-online.net!news.arcor.de.POSTED!not-for-mail Date: Sun, 19 Jul 2009 21:51:10 +0200 From: Georg Bauhaus Reply-To: rm.tsoh-bauhaus@maps.futureapps.de User-Agent: Thunderbird 2.0.0.22 (X11/20090608) MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.eiffel,comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.modula3,comp.programming Subject: Re: Alternatives to C: ObjectPascal, Eiffel, Ada or Modula-3? References: <7cf9peF2758tgU1@mid.individual.net> <1ac0d96f-9dfc-4bcb-abff-2f5cb1c5da8d@e4g2000vbe.googlegroups.com> <87tz18bskg.fsf@galatea.local> <4a635fa9$0$31329$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net> <87hbx8bi37.fsf@galatea.local> In-Reply-To: <87hbx8bi37.fsf@galatea.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Message-ID: <4a63792f$0$30235$9b4e6d93@newsspool1.arcor-online.net> Organization: Arcor NNTP-Posting-Date: 19 Jul 2009 21:51:11 CEST NNTP-Posting-Host: 562b974f.newsspool1.arcor-online.net X-Trace: DXC=dG89H<>oOaj9kIfcjg:0fdic==]BZ:afn4Fo<]lROoRa^YC2XCjHcbiK@IAnBOcfkhA:ho7QcPOVcQ4^14RZ64IhY@J;<8 Pascal J. Bourguignon wrote: > Moreover, notice how Pr. Knuth use a rather low level language to > describe his algorithms (a virtual machine language actually). He > doesn't expect anything fancy semantically from his algorithmic > language. http://www-cs-faculty.stanford.edu/~knuth/taocp.html Actually, a paradigmatic counter-example of Knuths' is, I think, Algorithm T (Topological sort in �2.2.3), which is I guess not targeted at number crunching, but serves as an example of ingenious use of hardware properties. While the description, "taking away nodes from a graph", is in a sense high level, the data structures used, and the runnable program are just about as far away from high level Lisp as can be, I'd think ;-) So how could this be achieved in a general fashion, using syntax transformation? So a translation that yields this proven un-functional data layout doesn't look so trivial to me; wouldn't you end up writing algorithm-specific optimizer macros or some such if you wanted the same efficiency to be gained from a Lisp DSL?