From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,3a4656a5edc0dab4 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public Path: controlnews3.google.com!news1.google.com!news.glorb.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!elnk-atl-nf1!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!d9c68f36!not-for-mail Message-ID: <40A8AD3A.6040803@noplace.com> From: Marin David Condic User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 (OEM-HPQ-PRS1C03) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Ada used in General Aviation (GA) applications? References: <409F69CB.8020604@noplace.com> <20619edc.0405120909.6ba1a793@posting.google.com> <40A35FF6.9050703@noplace.com> <87u0yivdwr.fsf@insalien.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 12:17:23 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.165.22.164 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net 1084796243 209.165.22.164 (Mon, 17 May 2004 05:17:23 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 17 May 2004 05:17:23 PDT Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net Xref: controlnews3.google.com comp.lang.ada:632 Date: 2004-05-17T12:17:23+00:00 List-Id: Keep in mind that I have done a study that showed a 50% reduction in development time and a factor of 4 improvement in defects. You may in fact be thinking of that very study here. I've made the statement here before. However, a) it is difficult-to-impossible to claim (from my study) that Ada was the only factor and b) enough of it was an "all other things being equal" environment to make the claim believable/useful. It was an embedded system environment with virtually all of the code home-grown. It was *not* an environment in which the OS, GUI, Database, Support Libraries, Etc., were all written in C and all the development tools were designed with C programming in mind. You want to take over - for example - Motorola cell phone applets? That's an interesting market, but you don't even have an Ada compiler supported for that environment - so all other things aren't equal. Then there's all the development tools & libraries around it and no similar suite of stuff for Ada. There is no "Development Kit" - so Ada can't play on even an equal footing - or play at all. All the abstract studies in the world citing double-your-productivity-and-reduce-your-bugs are useless unless and until you've got that development kit sitting right there available for use. My argument is not to deny the productivity and defect gains, but to insist that Ada needs to target a lucrative market and give it everything it needs to take advantage of the potential productivity gains. MDC Jeffrey Carter wrote: > > > I'm aware of 2 real-world studies, in 2 different domains, of real > projects, done both in C and Ada, with good metrics, that show that Ada > reaches deployment in half the time/cost of C. As a result, I see no > evidence to support claims that C-like languages have better > time-to-market characteristics than Ada. > > These same studies show Ada has a factor of 4 fewer post-deployment > errors, and a factor of 10 less time/cost to correct an error. > > Note to MDC: All other things are not equal, but that was true of these > projects as well, and Ada still came out with a factor of 2 advantage on > time to deployment. > -- ====================================================================== Marin David Condic I work for: http://www.belcan.com/ My project is: http://www.jsf.mil/NSFrames.htm Send Replies To: m o d c @ a m o g c n i c . r "Face it ladies, its not the dress that makes you look fat. Its the FAT that makes you look fat." -- Al Bundy ======================================================================