From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 1073c2,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid1073c2,public X-Google-Thread: 10a146,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid10a146,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 101deb,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid101deb,public X-Google-Thread: fdb77,c9f2b97a84c48976 X-Google-Attributes: gidfdb77,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-07-16 05:04:44 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!newsfeed.berkeley.edu!ucberkeley!sjc-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!iad-read.news.verio.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.java.programmer,comp.lang.pl1,comp.lang.vrml,comp.lang.java.advocacy References: <9gsvr7$7ho$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3b366a2b$6$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net> <9h7guv$pt1$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3B3879CE.AC550F8E@acm.org> <3B3E73E8.F9C36524@ix.netcom.com> <3B405DDF.5C3F9207@acm.org> <3B416975.D7F0691D@ix.netcom.com> <3B432AD8.3828FB9@acm.org> <9i1q0r$324$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <7F917.2087$jf.539468852@newssvr17.news.prodigy.com> <3B4648A3.BECC1FE8@acm.org> <3B47CB75.234C0543@acm.or g> From: "Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz" Subject: Re: Market pressures for more reliable software Mail-Copies-To: nobody Organization: Atid/2 X-Cise: "Tony Schliesser" X-CompuServe-Customer: Yes X-Coriate: NCAE@NewAmerica.org X-Ecrate: Bob Germer X-Punge: Micro$oft X-Sanguinate: themvsguy@email.com X-Terminate: SPA(GIS) Message-ID: <3b52d7f5$1$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net> X-Newsreader: MR/2 Internet Cruiser Edition for OS/2 v2.28a/28 Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 08:03:00 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.55.10.86 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: iad-read.news.verio.net 995285083 206.55.10.86 (Mon, 16 Jul 2001 12:04:43 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Mon, 16 Jul 2001 12:04:43 GMT Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:9990 comp.lang.java.programmer:82713 comp.lang.pl1:1237 comp.lang.vrml:4045 comp.lang.java.advocacy:23542 Date: 2001-07-16T08:03:00-04:00 List-Id: In , on 07/16/2001 at 12:56 AM, "Ken Garlington" said: >Errr... hello? Note that I am saying that *your definition* of >decentralized programming would lead one to the exact ridiculous >conclusion that you take so much care in ridiculing. I noted that you said that; I also noted that your claim was bogus. >I'm glad that we agree that defining "decentalized" in the manner >you appear to espouse is silly, since then there would then be no >possible chance to have a "centralized" environment. Really? No chance of having centralized control over programming, etc? It's not only possible, it's been done, quite often. My claim was that it was done only in specific contexts rather than as an industry norm. However, now I'm quite puzzled at what position you are trying to defend. JUst what is it that you claim was universally centralized prior to the PC, and by what definition, since you deny that cetralization of the obvious is possible? >Actually, I made an A in my logic course. Then you must have forgotten quite a bit. Either that, or you are deliberate refraining from logic. >How did you do in your debate course? Ah, so you have decided that winning a debate is more important than being correct? >So, you experience on the customer side indicates that the Brooks >description is atypical? My experience on the customer side indicates that there is massive variation in management style. I don't recall Brooks denying that. Brooks was describing how things were at IBM, or at least how he perceived them. >Perhaps you could justify such a >belief with some examples from your extensive business applications >development resume. Are you asking for examples of centralized development or for examples of decentralized development? Or just trying to muddy the water? -- ----------------------------------------------------------- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT Atid/2 Team OS/2 Team PL/I Any unsolicited commercial junk E-mail will be subject to legal action. I reserve the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail. I mangled my E-mail address to foil automated spammers; reply to domain acm dot org user shmuel to contact me. Do not reply to spamtrap@library.lspace.org -----------------------------------------------------------