From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: fdb77,c9f2b97a84c48976 X-Google-Attributes: gidfdb77,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: 1073c2,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid1073c2,public X-Google-Thread: 101deb,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid101deb,public X-Google-Thread: 10a146,23963231b5359f74 X-Google-Attributes: gid10a146,public X-Google-Thread: 1158e3,c9f2b97a84c48976 X-Google-Attributes: gid1158e3,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-06-20 04:29:35 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!sn-xit-02!supernews.com!easynews!cyclone2.usenetserver.com!sjc-peer.news.verio.net!news.verio.net!iad-read.news.verio.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada,ccomp.lang.clarion,comp.lang.java.programmer,comp.lang.pl1,comp.lang.vrml,comp.lang.java.advocacy References: <9folnd$1t8$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3B1FE1FE.B49AE27F@noaa.gov> <9fotpi$4k6$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3b24dc21$1@news.tce.com> <3B25D5FB.15C9B240@dresdner-bank.com> <9g5as6$hbq$1@magnum.mmm.com> <9g5ipg$roq$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <9g614i$at4$1@magnum.mmm.com> <9g7r02$mni$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <9g840k$qjt$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <40gfitgrvd8cgu27r3vfib6eptmapb3pfl@4ax.com> <9g8lrk$37c$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3B2B6D5E.F9AE7CAB@mail.com> <9gl0sh$9gq$1@nh.pace.co.uk> <3b2f40fc$7$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net> <9gnn8m$979$1@nh.pace.co.uk> From: "Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz" Subject: Re: Market pressures for more reliable software Mail-Copies-To: nobody Organization: Atid/2 X-Cise: "Tony Schliesser" X-CompuServe-Customer: Yes X-Coriate: NCAE@NewAmerica.org X-Ecrate: Bob Germer X-Punge: Micro$oft X-Sanguinate: themvsguy@email.com X-Terminate: SPA(GIS) Message-ID: <3b302794$8$fuzhry$mr2ice@va.news.verio.net> X-Newsreader: MR/2 Internet Cruiser Edition for OS/2 v2.28a/28 Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 00:33:24 -0400 NNTP-Posting-Host: 206.55.10.86 X-Complaints-To: abuse@verio.net X-Trace: iad-read.news.verio.net 993036570 206.55.10.86 (Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:29:30 GMT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 20 Jun 2001 11:29:30 GMT Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:8913 comp.lang.java.programmer:77546 comp.lang.pl1:1101 comp.lang.vrml:3882 comp.lang.java.advocacy:21492 Date: 2001-06-20T00:33:24-04:00 List-Id: In <9gnn8m$979$1@nh.pace.co.uk>, on 06/19/2001 at 10:23 AM, "Marin David Condic" said: >How far back can you remember? :-) Well before the term "MIS" came into vogue. My first computer was a vacuum tube machine that I will never be nostalgic about. >Seriously. I worked in a datacenter where the programming for the >whole organization was done in a central location by an MIS >department and batch jobs were run by the computer operators and all >anybody had was dumb terminals. There may have been *pockets* of >development taking place outside of MIS (the model was already >beginning to crumble because of mini computers) No doubt there were organizations where all of the programming was done by a centralized DP staff. But there were also organizations where the programming of a single machine was decentralized and the DP staff was only concerned with such issues as operations, maintenance of systems software and scheduling. In fact, there were shops where users were expected to run their own jobs as well as program them. Santayana. -- ----------------------------------------------------------- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT Atid/2 Team OS/2 Team PL/I Any unsolicited commercial junk E-mail will be subject to legal action. I reserve the right to publicly post or ridicule any abusive E-mail. I mangled my E-mail address to foil automated spammers; reply to domain acm dot org user shmuel to contact me. Do not reply to spamtrap@library.lspace.org -----------------------------------------------------------