From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=ham autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,38fc011071df5a27 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-09-19 05:22:35 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!cyclone.bc.net!sjc70.webusenet.com!news.webusenet.com!elnk-nf2-pas!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.pas.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3F6AF506.2050906@noplace.com> From: Marin David Condic User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.0.1) Gecko/20020823 Netscape/7.0 (OEM-HPQ-PRS1C03) X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: How to get a =?ISO-8859-1?Q?=BBConventional_Ada_Library=AB?= =?ISO-8859-1?Q?_=28Was=3A_Ideas_for_Ada_200X=29?= References: <6a90b886.0305262344.1d558079@posting.google.com> <3ED4A94C.2020501@noplace.com> <3ED6A852.75AC0133@adaworks.com> <3ED74ED3.4020505@noplace.com> <3ED7C8C5.3070902@cogeco.ca> <3ED826BB.9010509@noplace.com> <3F61BA28.3060507@crs4.it> <3F6205B8.3070402@attbi.com> <3F6316DC.7080106@noplace.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 12:22:34 GMT NNTP-Posting-Host: 165.247.64.12 X-Complaints-To: abuse@earthlink.net X-Trace: newsread1.news.atl.earthlink.net 1063974154 165.247.64.12 (Fri, 19 Sep 2003 05:22:34 PDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Fri, 19 Sep 2003 05:22:34 PDT Organization: EarthLink Inc. -- http://www.EarthLink.net Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:42679 Date: 2003-09-19T12:22:34+00:00 List-Id: Another important thing to notice is that when you are discussing a library, complexity doesn't insert itself into the language itself. The language can remain as simple and efficient and unencumbered as you like. The library may be complex, bloated, inefficient, etc. and if you don't like it, you don't use it. Not that I'm arguing for complex, bloated and inefficient software. Just observing that one can back off from a lot of the requirements one might have for a language feature when discussing a library - or a particular library feature. These days, linkers ought to be smart enough to only bring in the stuff that is actually called, so any given feature might get pretty huge and bloated without impacting anyone who doesn't need it. Libraries are a good thing and IMHO, the bigger the better. The more leverage I can get out of a library to build my end product, the less building I have to do, so I would put up with a lot of sub-optimal characteristics (such as possible complexity or inefficiency) in order to save me from having to do it myself. MDC Warren W. Gay VE3WWG wrote: > > > I think this is an excellent point that you make here. How many > times have we heard that a such-n-such proposal/implementation is > too large or complex, and then stop there. Yet, as you point out, > others are already _using_ libraries far more (or equally) complex > in their day to day work. Simplicity is certainly a good goal, but > let's all realize that sometimes functionality dictates a more > complicated world. > > Equally important is the fact that "they" are using something, and > often "we" are not. While the Booch Components often gets criticised > for their complexity (in instantiation mostly I think), they are a > very functional set of packages. They would be easier to use with > the appropriate level of documentation, which hasn't happened yet > (I had actually made it a goal to write such, but as you can see, > haven't come through on that yet). But the point here is that they > are fairly complete in functionality, but yet for one reason or > another, not fully accepted by the community (or maybe they have, > but the lurkers are not saying that ;-) ). > >> MDC > > -- ====================================================================== Marin David Condic I work for: http://www.belcan.com/ My project is: http://www.jsf.mil/NSFrames.htm Send Replies To: m c o n d i c @ a c m . o r g "All reformers, however strict their social conscience, live in houses just as big as they can pay for." --Logan Pearsall Smith ======================================================================