From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-0.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00, REPLYTO_WITHOUT_TO_CC autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 103376,38fc011071df5a27 X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2003-05-29 17:37:34 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!news1.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!logbridge.uoregon.edu!newshub.sdsu.edu!newsfeed2.earthlink.net!newsfeed.earthlink.net!stamper.news.pas.earthlink.net!stamper.news.atl.earthlink.net!harp.news.atl.earthlink.net!not-for-mail From: Richard Riehle Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Subject: Re: Ideas for Ada 200X Date: Thu, 29 May 2003 17:39:46 -0700 Organization: AdaWorks Software Engineering Message-ID: <3ED6A852.75AC0133@adaworks.com> References: <6a90b886.0305262344.1d558079@posting.google.com> <3ED4A94C.2020501@noplace.com> Reply-To: richard@adaworks.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 41.b2.60.fb Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Server-Date: 30 May 2003 00:37:34 GMT X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.7 [en] (Win98; I) X-Accept-Language: en Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:38026 Date: 2003-05-30T00:37:34+00:00 List-Id: Marin David Condic wrote: > This is another case where having some sort of Conventional Ada Library > external of the standard would be A Good Thing. Get things like this > into the library quickly, gain some experience with use and when they > stabilize discuss the possibility of including them into the standard. The two most important features of Java are the libraries and the JVM. The language is rather pedestrian and of would be of little consequence if it were not for the libraries. We have never been able to agree on the format of nor the functionality of standard libraries for Ada (with the exception of a conservative few that made it into the Ada 95 Annexes). As a consequence, newcomers find themselves prowling around the Web to locate something they can use for graphics, GUI's, data structures, etc. Java has a corporate sponsor and is not an ISO standard (nor will it be for a while). C++ has the STL, but it interfaces well to MFC and other GUI environments. Sadly, there is no corporate or governmental sponsor for Ada so most of the effort is either a "labor of love" (Charles, GWindows, CLAW, etc.), or produce for a specific need as needed. It is a big mistake for the DoD to discontinue funding for Ada since it is still used for a lot of projects. In fact, some of those organizations that charged off in the direction of C++ have discovered the folly of that decision. Unfortunately, instead of returning to Ada, as they should, they are attempting to use even more inappropriate tools such as Java, largely because of hype, but also because of the libraries. This could be fixed, but it will required money. Where will that money come from? What company with deep pockets is willing to fund Ada? The recent discussion about JSF developers deciding to use Ada because, even though it is a better language for the purpose than C, it is not popular enough, should be a good lesson. They, in effect, have said, we are picking the less effective set of tools because more people know how to use them. While this is an emminently stupid line of reasoning, it illustrates the prevailing rationale for language selection. The availability of good libaries will not cure anyone of congenital stupidity, but it might make some potential users of Ada more amenable to helping it become more popular. Richard Riehle