From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.6 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,TO_NO_BRKTS_FROM_MSSP autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: 107f24,582dff0b3f065a52 X-Google-Attributes: gid107f24,public X-Google-Thread: 109fba,582dff0b3f065a52 X-Google-Attributes: gid109fba,public X-Google-Thread: 1014db,582dff0b3f065a52 X-Google-Attributes: gid1014db,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,bc1361a952ec75ca X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-ArrivalTime: 2001-08-22 11:45:07 PST Path: archiver1.google.com!newsfeed.google.com!newsfeed.stanford.edu!news-spur1.maxwell.syr.edu!news.maxwell.syr.edu!cpk-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!chcgil2-snh1.gtei.net!cambridge1-snf1.gtei.net!news.gtei.net!bos-service1.ext.raytheon.com!dfw-service2.ext.raytheon.com.POSTED!not-for-mail Message-ID: <3B83F9D6.73CB3E02@west.raytheon.com> From: Jerry Petrey <"jdpetrey"@west.raytheon.com> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.76 [en]C-CCK-MCD CSC;Raytheon (WinNT; U) X-Accept-Language: en MIME-Version: 1.0 Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.c,comp.lang.c++,comp.lang.functional Subject: Re: How Ada could have prevented the Red Code distributed denial of service attack. References: <3B6555ED.9B0B0420@sneakemail.com> <87n15lxzzv.fsf@deneb.enyo.de> <3B672322.B5EA1B66@home.com> <4a885870.0108112341.7ce02ac0@posting.google.com> <3B834E5D.B0D26AB1@adaworks.com> <9lvsic$bet9s$1@ID-9852.news.dfncis.de> <9m0193$grs$1@bird.wu-wien.ac.at> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 11:28:39 -0700 NNTP-Posting-Host: 147.24.83.38 X-Complaints-To: news@ext.ray.com X-Trace: dfw-service2.ext.raytheon.com 998505032 147.24.83.38 (Wed, 22 Aug 2001 13:30:32 CDT) NNTP-Posting-Date: Wed, 22 Aug 2001 13:30:32 CDT Organization: Raytheon Company Xref: archiver1.google.com comp.lang.ada:12271 comp.lang.c:76202 comp.lang.c++:84914 comp.lang.functional:7629 Date: 2001-08-22T11:28:39-07:00 List-Id: Ted Dennison wrote: > > In article <9m0193$grs$1@bird.wu-wien.ac.at>, Markus Mottl says... > > > >In comp.lang.functional Joachim Durchholz wrote: > >> Could you share a reference to a report? > >As usual, official reports (i.e. by the Navy itself) that indicate > >shortcomings of their weapon technology do not circulate for too long > >for obvious reasons (but maybe they are just hidden well enough). > > Well, I should point out that this isn't really "weapons technology". Its just > the engine control systems. The weapons are controlled by completely different > systems. > > > > >There are plenty of serious media that report on the case, e.g. Government > >Computing News: > > > > http://www.gcn.com/archives/gcn/1998/december14/39.htm > > http://www.gcn.com/vol18_no36/com/903-1.html > > I used to work at a place that was the competitor to the company that supplied > this system. I could add a lot of semi-insider elaboration to all this, but > that's probably best done in private (perhaps over a beer or two). If Jerry > Petrey's reading, he may have more info on this than I do. > > This is actually a bit *worse* than it may sound to a civilian. I understand > that for a Navy captain, having to be towed in to port is a rough equivalent in > embarassment to being publicly gelded and then paraded through town. We would > occasionally have engineers *flown*out* to ships to aviod this... > > We offered a system using technology hand-picked for reliability. Our legacy > stuff was all CMS-2, but for new work we bid Unix and Ada. We once even tried > out NT, and it was purposely put on a non-critical redundant device, to aviod > the possiblity of it causing a failure all by itself. > > Our competitor got themselves a R&D contract, and proceeded to use the most > buzzword-compliant technologies they could find (at the time, NT and C++, with > some AI thrown in for good measure). They then tried to leverage their R&D work > into actual production for new ships, with the brass that was in charge of the > R&D work championing them. What you read above is the result. > > --- > T.E.D. homepage - http://www.telepath.com/dennison/Ted/TED.html > home email - mailto:dennison@telepath.com I think you covered it pretty well, Ted. We had a very good implementation of the engine controller in Ada but the management was so poor that they allowed it to be re-written (after I left) in C or C++ from what I've heard - to be more 'politically correct'. That was their downfall. Jerry -- ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Jerry Petrey -- Senior Principal Systems Engineer - Navigation, Guidance, & Control -- Raytheon Missile Systems - Member Team Ada & Team Forth -- NOTE: please remove in email address to reply -----------------------------------------------------------------------------