From mboxrd@z Thu Jan  1 00:00:00 1970
X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me
X-Spam-Level: 
X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.3 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,INVALID_MSGID
	autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4
X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit
X-Google-Thread: 103376,a83c46b54bacb7f6
X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public
From: "Mike Silva" <mjsilva@jps.net>
Subject: Re: JOB:Sr. SW Engineers Wanted-Fortune 500 Co
Date: 2000/01/31
Message-ID: <38967537_1@news.jps.net>#1/1
X-Deja-AN: 580222512
References: <3894A823.92EC75D1@bondtechnologies.com>
 <874b7r$mj9$1@nnrp1.deja.com> <t7iu09q36i.fsf@calumny.jyacc.com>
X-Original-NNTP-Posting-Host: 209.63.224.240
X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3
X-Trace: 31 Jan 2000 21:55:03 -0800, 209.239.195.143
Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada
Date: 2000-01-31T00:00:00+00:00
List-Id: <comp.lang.ada>

Hyman Rosen <hymie@prolifics.com> writes:
>> Ted Dennison <dennison@telepath.com> writes:
>> >    3. I think I speak for most (if not everyone) here when I say that I
>> > find it appalling that anyone would develop a product like a pacemaker,
>> > on which the life of a human being depends on its continuous reliable
>> > operation, in a language known to be as error-prone as C. This is not
an
>> > opportunity for me to be "improving other's lives". It's an opportunity
>> > for me to screw up and *take* someone's life. No thanks.
>>
>> Good thing the Ariane 5 didn't land on anyone's house.

>OK, I'm being a smartass, but I am making a valid point.
>Having its software written in Ada was not enough to keep
>the Ariane 5 from going off-course and being blown up. In
>the same way, having the software of a pacemaker written
>in C is not enough to force it to blow up.

This is a silly strawman, since nobody (at least, nobody who wants to be
taken seriously) ever makes such extreme claims.  It's all a matter of
increasing the odds, and both the C language and the C culture invite buggy
code (sad to say, I've written my share).  Every C programmer should perform
the eye-opening exercise of determining how many C bugs they encounter would
not have been possible, or would have been quickly spotted, in Ada.  I did,
and the answer was "most!"  I wonder if the C culture doesn't just accept
these language-preventable bugs as a fact of life, as I did for many years,
without realizing how many can be caught by a safer language (and the
culture of safety that will naturally accompany it).

>I would assume
>that pacemaker software undergoes thorough critical-systems
>development and testing regardless of what language it's
>written in.

I think one Ariane investor was overheard saying something similar to
another Ariane investor just before liftoff...

Mike