From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=0.2 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00,INVALID_MSGID, REPLYTO_WITHOUT_TO_CC autolearn=no autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Google-Language: ENGLISH,ASCII-7-bit X-Google-Thread: f43e6,2c6139ce13be9980 X-Google-Attributes: gidf43e6,public X-Google-Thread: 103376,3d3f20d31be1c33a X-Google-Attributes: gid103376,public X-Google-Thread: fac41,2c6139ce13be9980 X-Google-Attributes: gidfac41,public X-Google-Thread: 1108a1,2c6139ce13be9980 X-Google-Attributes: gid1108a1,public From: Ken Garlington Subject: Re: The presuppositions of all the Ariane 5 analysts. Date: 1997/07/23 Message-ID: <33D69B2B.96A@flash.net>#1/1 X-Deja-AN: 258637947 References: <33C835A5.362A@flash.net> <33CC0548.4099@flash.net> <5qitoi$fdv$1@news.irisa.fr> <33CD6512.2404@flash.net> <01bc92e6$7a6f9e40$287b7b7a@tlo2> <33CEAF05.6389@flash.net> <33D2827B.41C67EA6@eiffel.com> <5qucs7$jie$3@flood.weeg.uiowa.edu> <33D3C7E4.764E@link.com> <33D4647D.6D2A@erols.com> Organization: Flashnet Communications, http://www.flash.net Reply-To: kennieg@flash.net Newsgroups: comp.object,comp.software-eng,comp.lang.ada,comp.lang.eiffel Date: 1997-07-23T00:00:00+00:00 List-Id: Luther Hampton wrote: > > > Stating ONLY that the new item would have prevented the crash > > is a misleading half truth. > > I don't think that's what he said. I assume you are still claiming he > said only DBC would have prevented the problem, he didn't. See section 2, bullet (c), in http://www.progsoc.uts.edu.au/~geldridg/eiffel/ariane/ for a discussion of why it appears he did, in fact, claim that DBC/Eiffel by itself would have been adequate. > Statement > (2), that Eiffel is the only language which supports DBC, is much more > controversial. Meyer makes no secret of the fact that he considers > Eiffel the solution to many software development problems. He has not > claimed to be objective... Actually, he (and his co-author) has claimed in various threads that his analysis is not specific to Eiffel, although the paper takes the position you suggest. > Agreed. No method/language/tool can be effective if it is not properly > employed. As you pointed out earlier, the major fault for the failure > appaers to lie with the management, which apparently didn't enforce the > procedures that were in place. That is not to say, however, that Eiffel > or DBC might have helped. There were also other factors, beyond "poor management," that could have played a factor in defeating DBC/Eiffel. This is discussed in more detail on the web page referenced above.