From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 X-Spam-Checker-Version: SpamAssassin 3.4.4 (2020-01-24) on polar.synack.me X-Spam-Level: X-Spam-Status: No, score=-1.9 required=5.0 tests=BAYES_00 autolearn=unavailable autolearn_force=no version=3.4.4 X-Received: by 10.42.153.133 with SMTP id m5mr1000041icw.4.1422407766881; Tue, 27 Jan 2015 17:16:06 -0800 (PST) X-Received: by 10.182.97.106 with SMTP id dz10mr5817obb.31.1422407766418; Tue, 27 Jan 2015 17:16:06 -0800 (PST) Path: eternal-september.org!reader01.eternal-september.org!reader02.eternal-september.org!news.eternal-september.org!mx02.eternal-september.org!feeder.eternal-september.org!usenet.blueworldhosting.com!feeder01.blueworldhosting.com!peer02.iad.highwinds-media.com!news.highwinds-media.com!feed-me.highwinds-media.com!hl2no3360029igb.0!news-out.google.com!qk8ni18470igc.0!nntp.google.com!hl2no2915024igb.0!postnews.google.com!glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Newsgroups: comp.lang.ada Date: Tue, 27 Jan 2015 17:16:06 -0800 (PST) In-Reply-To: <6b118519-c141-46fd-a017-f3af3809e5e0@googlegroups.com> Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: glegroupsg2000goo.googlegroups.com; posting-host=73.46.72.234; posting-account=yiWntAoAAAC1KqC_shmxJYv07B9l6LNU NNTP-Posting-Host: 73.46.72.234 References: <616ae348-41f6-446f-9c4b-0da8e398e75b@googlegroups.com> <1391828381444007928.494546nonlegitur-futureapps.invalid@reader80.eternal-september.org> <6b118519-c141-46fd-a017-f3af3809e5e0@googlegroups.com> User-Agent: G2/1.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID: <1d4f22a2-0127-48d8-a097-287b9d982945@googlegroups.com> Subject: Re: What is the best license to use for open source software? From: David Botton Injection-Date: Wed, 28 Jan 2015 01:16:06 +0000 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Received-Bytes: 4630 X-Received-Body-CRC: 1194306534 Xref: news.eternal-september.org comp.lang.ada:24770 Date: 2015-01-27T17:16:06-08:00 List-Id: > With Ada it is an entirely different story. Vendors (mostly AdaCore) nee= d revenue on the tools themselves because that is all they have for assets.= Their market is very small and not going to grow - they already have the = customers who need it. Actually, it is not that different at all. AdaCore does near zero R&D unles= s requested and paid for (at least in large part) directly by a customer. S= o the only difference is who does the actual development. With C/C++, etc. = the customers themselves do the dev work in the case of Ada it is AdaCore g= enerally being outsourced for the work to support some project and the AdaC= ore supporting the result for them and others interested. AdaCore doesn't make money on the compiler (even they though are confused a= bout what actual product they are selling sometimes), their product is supp= ort contracts, i.e. they are selling resources and talent. > Its disappointing that Ada is locked into this niche and shows little pot= ential to break out. It is not "locked" in and I don't believe it has little potential to break = out. If that was the case I would not have created Gnoga or continue toward= s my goals of opening the Ada market beyond that niche, nor would many othe= rs bother with their efforts to make Ada available with out a virus. Since AdaCore doesn't understand how to make money beyond the "grant" model= (it is a general issue with academics in business) they've done their best= to force customer lock in. This has the unfortunate result of making it ve= ry hard for Ada to grow beyond their niche and harms Ada advocacy in genera= l. In time the lack of creativity and R&D will cause an implosion, but most= of us here (including myself) are not anti-AdaCore and hopefully what effo= rts we can make on our own for Ada despite the stumbling blocks they have l= aid (and yes strangely with their help as well with the FSF upstream, and w= hile it doesn't balance their actions, it at least reduces the sting), our = efforts will generate enough interest and market to keep them from implodin= g sooner but rather much later. > Most believe "good enough" is just that and refuse to spend anything on s= omething better. Not 100% true, the issue is that speed to market today is more important th= an initial quality for most non-safety critical systems. That however is Ada's greatest value, minimal additional development time f= or considerable improvements in quality and long term maintainability.=20 However no one (yet ;) is marketing that angle since the "niche" market for= AdaCore is safety critical and they already understand the need for qualit= y and get what Spark and other Ada related products can add, and can and wi= ll pay for AdaCore's only actual product "support". > Back to the race to the bottom... I don't feel until you contribute time and product, "damnation" is your rig= ht... but being from the US, say what you will and me and the posy working = to change things for the better despite the stumbling blocks and not just m= uck raking will dance on your words when things materialize for the better = ;) I challenge you to make a difference :) David Botton